Just Standing By (990 hits)
Category: GeneralRating: 1.84 on 36 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Forensic (View user info) at 2009-01-09 21:19:13 EST
This is a little long.
Earlier this week, I spoke on the phone with a detective assigned to a case that involves an older woman who disappeared. I should mention that it was I who called the detective, and not for the first time either. I first spoke to this detective almost one year ago when the woman first went missing. Apparently, I was one of the last people to see her before she disappeared based on the timeline the detective worked out.
When I still lived at an apartment complex, this particular woman lived in the adjacent building and frequently knocked on my door to use my phone. It was obvious then that she was not very well off. She didn't have a working phone, her clothes looked like they came from a thrift store, and she weighed about 90 lbs. soaking wet.
Her demeanor was that of a skittish cat, feral after years of living in the shadows. When she would knock on my door, I would invite her in so that she could use my phone in comfort. She always refused though and so I would hand her the cordless and she would make her calls out in the breezeway. I figured she just wanted her privacy.
Last January, she again knocked on my door. Figuring she wanted the phone, I opened the door and started my ritual of inviting her in. That time she accepted. Once she was in and the door was shut, she asked in a halting, humiliated voice, if I had some food that she could have. I'm not sure why I was shocked at that, like I said before, it was obvious that she was in need of a great many things. Fortunately I had gone to the store recently so I got a paper sack and gave her what I had on hand. I'm sure non fat yogurt, fruit, and other similar fare wouldn't serve her as well as something heartier, but it was what I had.
I didn't want to ask why she needed this food. As she took the bag, she explained that her "nephew had thrown out" all her food. "Oh?" I asked trying to be nonchalant, "you live with your nephew?" She then explained that her nephew had recently moved in. With that, she took the sack and scurried away.
Two days after that when I was arriving home from work at 11:30 pm, a policeman was in the parking lot. He approached me when I got out of my car and asked me which apartment I lived in and if I knew the woman. I told him that I didn't really 'know' her, but I knew who she was. Then he started asking when I last saw her, under what circumstance, what did she say, etc. After jotting down what I said and my name and phone number, he informed me that within the next day or so someone would be contacting me because she had mysteriously disappeared, along with the nephew, and no other member of the family knew where they went.
When the detective came by my place and talked to me, he told me that he thought I was one of the last people to have talked to her. He brought me up to speed. The woman was disabled, feeble, and within the last few months, had allowed a nephew to move in with her. This nephew, of course, had a rather long history of running afoul of the law. Burglary, assault, drugs, and other run of the mill white trash criminal behavior. Sometime after her last visit to my place and when the police came to investigate, she disappeared, her bank account was emptied, and the nephew took off.
I asked him if he thought the nephew killed her. Naturally he was reticent to commit one way or another, but he told me he wouldn't be surprised if he had killed her. He also told me that although they're looking for him, it was assumed that the nephew had left the state and they had to wait until he turned up. As the detective left, I told him that if she was dead, they'll probably never find her. She was so little and frail that someone could cut her up and dispose of her in two garbage bags and no one would be the wiser until so much time had passed, forensics would have a hell of a time figuring out when and how she died. "Yeah," the detective said, "unfortunately, you're probably right."
A few weeks later, the nephew was located in Utah, but without any evidence that the woman was dead (no body, no blood, etc.), they couldn't extradite him. So, the case stalled and finally went into a coma of sorts. To this date, the woman is still missing.
You get a weird feeling when you know that you were among the last people to see someone before they vanish. I began to question my choices I had made. Why exactly didn't I take more of an intrusive approach with her? Why didn't I ask her why her nephew threw out her food? Why didn't I ask her if she was alright? Why didn't I call someone in the social services? With my contacts, I surely could have tracked down her caseworker and asked what was up.
I knew the answer of course. It was the same reason why Kitty Genovese was murdered in an alleyway behind her apartment complex in 1964 in New York City despite her loud, repeated screams for help. It isn't that they didn't "care." It wasn't that I didn't "care," because I actually did.
During a psychology student's undergrad years, a social psychology course is usually required and it is here where you're introduced to concepts like "The Bystander Effect," "Apathy," "Altruism." As an undergraduate, I had to study the Kitty Genovese case and the Bystander Effect. When the Kitty Genovese case first made headlines around the country, people decried New Yorkers' apathy and callousness. How could anyone ignore the cries of a woman as she was being brutally murdered beneath their very windows?!
Thing is, they really didn't. A call was in fact made to the police when Genovese was first attacked. But presumably since in New York where the crime rate was high, one call about a screaming woman didn't alarm the police enough to respond more urgently than they did. From that point on, every person in Genovese's apartment complex assumed that someone else had called the police and they couldn't do much more than listen to her screams and wonder where in the hell the police were.
That is the Bystander Effect. When a group of people all witness the same emergency, people tend to assume that someone else has made a call or that someone else is more qualified to help. Perhaps it is slightly different now with a cellphone in nearly everyone's hand but the Bystander Effect still can be observed in that unless people actually see another person call for help in behalf of the victim, they'll simply stand to the side or scurry away.
Essentially that is what I did. I knew that my former neighbor was on state assistance, and that if one is on state assistance, especially if they're disabled or have other problems, they usually have some sort of case worker. Surely the case worker keeps somewhat of an eye on her, I thought.
Then again, as a long time healthcare worker myself, I knew that state caseworkers were overburdened with more people than they could handle. Also as a long term healthcare worker, I could see that she was sickly and frail. I knew what someone in trouble looked liked. Her demeanor also suggested to me that something wasn't quite right. In all practicality, I could have and should have done something.
Those thoughts began to eat at me. Friends and family kept trying to reassure me that there was nothing I could have done to prevent what happened to her. "How could you have possibly known?" they rhetorically asked. That didn't really comfort me because I had already passed summary judgment on myself.
I would have much rather done something intrusive like knock on her door from time to time just to check on her. I could have tracked down her caseworker. I could have done a dozen different things.
As I had said at the beginning, I called the detective assigned to her now stalled case. As expected, nothing new had been discovered. They looked but haven't been able to find a body; they combed the apartment but couldn't find a trace of anything that hinted at what happened to her. The nephew was still out of state and they didn't have enough to drag him back.
I find it ironic that as an individual, I prefer having my own privacy. I would probably resent people being intrusive with me. I may even snap at them and inform the interested party that I can take care of myself, thank you very much. The ironic thing is that this attitude of mine, which is shared by a lot of others, could end up screwing us.
Such is human nature.
Fortunately I haven't had any similar situations brought to my attention. I just hope that when and if it happens, I will remember this.
User Reviews
Submitted by mystiamoon (user info) at 2009-05-12 11:38:53 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by EmissionImpossible (user info) at 2009-05-12 11:26:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
YOU ARE HOT xx email me the pic!
Submitted by JonnyX (user info) at 2009-03-20 02:22:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
look at me, I've been dead, nobody cares...
Submitted by RoadSong (user info) at 2009-02-02 19:54:28 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
This story has stayed with me since I first read it.Your compassion for this woman shows what kind of person you are.You fed her and let her use your phone.I admire you for all you did to help.
Submitted by stevie_says (user info) at 2009-01-31 01:44:17 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Derp
Submitted by Susie_Derkins (user info) at 2009-01-15 23:07:03 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I knew there was a reason I liked you. You're just like me, except slender and blonde.
Submitted by Vas_Deferens (user info) at 2009-01-14 07:47:10 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I followed a guy home in his car xmas eve 2004. I had been tailing him on the freeway and had noticed his left rear tyre was rolling around left and right like a drunk trying to prop himself against a nightclub wall on the way to the taxi rank.
We stopped at some lights after exiting the freeway, I was about to jump out and say hey your back wheel is about to fall off and the lights turned green. God dammit I thought and turned down the street behind him. It was christmas eve and he might be putting kids in that car tomorrow, so following him was no big deal. I literally followed that fucker through a maze of back streets and started to wonder if I would ever find my way back home - when home was all I wanted, he finally pulled up in a cul-de-sac, I pulled up behind him and walked over.
"Hi. I've been following you since the Gateway and your left rear wheel is all over the shop, I just thought you should know."
"okay, thanks" he said with his give a fuck attitude.
He never changed that wheel or even looked at it I'm certain, I'd made diddly squat impact. I may as well have just tried to channel the cunt through the cunt channeling ether at the lights, it would have made just as much difference.
Submitted by F.J.Bell (user info) at 2009-01-14 07:29:59 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I don't think you have any reason to feel guilty, to be honest. I probably wouldn't have even let her use my phone.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2009-01-14 07:13:18 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
Oh yeah, go fuck yourself Berty
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2009-01-13 08:42:17 EST (#)
Ranking: -2
The point I'm driving at is that in spite of your feelings, in spite of what may have happened, it is debatable whether or not you sticking your oar in would have been appropriate.
----
Why am I not surprised at that?
Gee, shouldn't I "be ashamed of myself" for being nosy and wanting to do something to help?!
You're right. You're absolutely right. We all need to have the attitude that we should NEVER get involved.
If the nephew did something to her, I'm sure that was just a part of their culture, right?
Nooooo I had absolutely no call to be concerned.
Shame on me for wanting to inflict my egocentric ideals onto someone else!
Yes, from now on I shall cower in my home, peering out of the window blinds, quake with fear, and impotently sit by because I don't have the fucking spine to stand for anything.
Silly, selfish, imperialistic, racist me.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2009-01-13 07:26:28 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Recently in Britain there have been two shocking cases which have rocked the welfare system. The first, baby P, was a tragic tale of abuse. The home consited of the mother, her boyfriend and the baby. The boyfriend was known to be abusive and the baby was regularly battered. At the autopsy doctors discovered multiple fractures and contusions. The baby's back had been broken. All very shocking.
Public outcry condemned the doctor who saw the baby when she was alive and missed the snapped spine. Also vilified were the healthcare officials who did not 'take the baby away in time'.
Later, after the people and media had forgotton to be outraged, the consensus was that welfare workers, medical workers and police had been "too optimistic" about baby P's family. That welfare workers had been too ready to believe the mother's commitments to doing better by her child, that her boyfriend was no longer abusive.
In the end; it was (alledgedly) the boyfriend who killed the child and the mother who stood by and let it happen. Health and welfare workers have been penalised in the past for swooping in and taking children from families.
The same is true in your instance. The nephew is (alledgedly) responsible. You know that though, of course. As long as you have compassion and faith in your own abilities and training you will feel guilty. Understandable of course.
The point I'm driving at is that in spite of your feelings, in spite of what may have happened, it is debatable whether or not you sticking your oar in would have been appropriate.
Submitted by Sidivan (user info) at 2009-01-12 11:54:12 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Look at it this way. She came to you for help when she needed food. You gave her food. Unless she asked for something else, there's not much else you could've done. Were there a million different ways this could've gone down? Of course, but those other ways don't matter. Let's say you went back to her apartment. Off the top of my head here are the things that may have happened:
Her apartment is messy with an inch of dust on everything.
She has a spotless apartment and a closet full of nice clothes that she never wore.
She had alzheimers and had ample food in her apartment
Her nephew really did throw away the food, but it was because it was all expired.
Her nephew replaced the food with good stuff and she thought she couldn't eat it because it was his.
She was a conniving old broad who just wanted to case your place so she could rob it later.
Every decision has an infinite amount of outcomes ranging from very likely to not likely at all. Until the decision is made, every one of these outcomes exists simultaneously. Surely, you've heard of Shroedinger's (sp?) Cat. This is precisely what he was proving with that entire situation. You don't know the outcome until it happens.
Now, chain together a series of decisions and you multiply their outcomes. So, maybe she wouldn't have opened the door to her apt. Now what? Do you go in? Do you call somebody? It's none of your damned business what's going on behind that door. Let's say she DOES let you in and you find food everywhere. Do you get pissed? Do you yell at her for using you?
Hindsight is NEVER 20/20. I agree that you can theorize about what could've happened, but you still don't know for sure. You have to live with the consequences of any decision because there's nothing you can do about it now. Because of this, you shouldn't beat yourself up over things that happened in the past.
Submitted by RoadSong (user info) at 2009-01-11 00:07:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
You tried to help and you did your best.
Submitted by i_can_get_you_a_toe (user info) at 2009-01-10 10:40:43 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
The very fact that, even though you really couldn't have changed events, but you still hurt, makes you a really decent person.
It's all subjective really, I once stood up for some random guy that was getting beaten up on the side of the road and got a big black eye for my troubles. Sometimes, just don't wade into other people's shit.
Submitted by Shlongy (user info) at 2009-01-10 09:21:07 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Cool. Maybe they'll turn this into a CBS 48 Hours episode and they'll get some hot broad to play you in the re-enactment.
Submitted by monkeyswithguns (user info) at 2009-01-10 06:39:57 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by lungfish (user info) at 2009-01-10 00:39:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
You couldn't have known, and probably shouldn't have suspected.
================================================================================
To add to this, as someone who presumably has studied some form of psychology, keep in mind that you're judging yourself by hindsight, which is 20/20, and that in a "current situation" frame of mind, such as at the time, there were probably 5 bajillion things going on in your head besides her.
To be certain it's disconcerting to know at this very moment that there are elderly people out there being taken advantage of by their near kin, (I can think of 3 or more right now who are friends or close relatives) however, you can't necessarily intervene on their behalf all of the time, or YOU will become their case-worker. If that's your thing, great, but ya gotta pick your battles.
Besides, you know perfectly well that had you attempted to intervene, she would have denied it, said everything was fine to protect him, and there would have been no further attempts to assist her, unless coming from you. Her family probably did try to intervene with no success (assuming they weren't just looking for her for a loan....)
Anyway, time to get ready for work, Be at peace.
Good post +2
Submitted by Crystle (user info) at 2009-01-10 03:46:59 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by SilvrWolf (user info) at 2009-01-10 02:31:23 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
You can't blame yourself for any of that. I hope that this was more for catharsis than anything else. You couldn't have known that she was going to disappear.
Submitted by Caulaincourt (user info) at 2009-01-10 02:20:45 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
maybe you're the killer and this is your alibi
Submitted by lungfish (user info) at 2009-01-10 00:39:51 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
You couldn't have known, and probably shouldn't have suspected. Only one person to blame for the presumed crime.
Submitted by experima (user info) at 2009-01-10 00:22:18 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by Porcelain (user info) at 2009-01-10 00:17:26 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by sandmantate (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:00:22 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
What can I say that you haven't heard a hundred times? You are a good person, and there is no reason to beat yourself up. Could you have done something more? Yeah, but maybe you are gulity of a far lesser crime. You are guilty of being empathetic with her. You say yourself that you wouldn't want anybody being intrusive with you, so you respected her and her privacy. Honestly, I think that she would have asked for help if she felt she needed it. In fact- she did. She broke the routine and accepted your invitation to come inside when she normally would have said no. She asked you for all the help that she was willing to accept from anyone. If anything, you should give yourself credit that you may have been the only friend this girl had, and you were the one she went to when she needed someone.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:41:26 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
This is why I carry a hammer and gun in my car.
Submitted by YourNameHere (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:28:55 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Snark (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:46:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Despite all the fucking around we all do on this site, it is pretty easy to read through the things people put into type and get a glimpse of who they really are.
---
LOL
Submitted by Ducky (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:23:32 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
As an outsider though, I would say that you shouldn't be beating yourself up over it.
Submitted by Ducky (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:20:36 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Wow forensic. Mitigating circumstances etc. aside...while I'm not sure you've made any mistakes here, if you feel you have then all you can do is learn from them. Cliche, but true. I'd be feeling the exact same way regardless of what anyone said to me.
Submitted by YourNameHere (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:12:50 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
This is your alibi, isn't it?
"But Detective, why would I have written about it if I was the one who killed her? That would be pretty stupid."
*uncrosses legs, shows snatch, recrosses legs*
Submitted by sandmantate (user info) at 2009-01-09 23:00:22 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
What can I say that you haven't heard a hundred times? You are a good person, and there is no reason to beat yourself up. Could you have done something more? Yeah, but maybe you are gulity of a far lesser crime. You are guilty of being empathetic with her. You say yourself that you wouldn't want anybody being intrusive with you, so you respected her and her privacy. Honestly, I think that she would have asked for help if she felt she needed it. In fact- she did. She broke the routine and accepted your invitation to come inside when she normally would have said no. She asked you for all the help that she was willing to accept from anyone. If anything, you should give yourself credit that you may have been the only friend this girl had, and you were the one she went to when she needed someone.
Submitted by JustARide (user info) at 2009-01-09 22:54:15 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
It's nice to know my first rating was on something well worth reading.
I can't ever say that I can fully relate to this post as it's a situation I've never been in but I must say that you shouldn't beat yourself up about it. At least you were there for the woman in question in some way. She came to you for something and instead of doing what 8 out of 10 cats would do and telling her to fuck off, you obliged her requests. You should feel good for what you did, not bad for what you couldn't have anticipated.
Submitted by Bubba2341 (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:58:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
I believe Snark said it all. You are a very good person.
Submitted by Snark (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:54:09 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:48:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Well thanks but I've beaten myself up quite a bit over this.
Hindsight you know is...
-----------------------
I know exactly what you mean. I won't bore you with the details but I understand the doubt of whether or not you could have done more all-to-well and I understand that nothing I write will really dampen it. I'm just saying there's nothing wrong with cutting yourself some slack.
She had someone she could turn to for communication and food. Those may not seem like big things but they are essentials of life and you provided them when she needed them most... not her family or case worker but you.
Submitted by forensicgirl3 (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:48:48 EST (#)
Ranking: 0
Well thanks but I've beaten myself up quite a bit over this.
Hindsight you know is...
Submitted by Snark (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:46:52 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
You have absolutely no reason to be hard on yourself. I think that most people would have balked at letting her into their home let alone giving her food out of their fridge. From what I've read here, if there had been any evidence that there was any immediate danger to her, you would have done whatever you could to help.
You are a good person that did a good thing for a stranger in need. The fact that your conscience is bothering you a bit is testament to the quality of your character.
Despite all the fucking around we all do on this site, it is pretty easy to read through the things people put into type and get a glimpse of who they really are.
There are people on Uber that I count myself lucky to have come into what limited contact this site provides. You are one of them.
Submitted by joedaddy (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:38:47 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
i spent 26yrs fixing shit, or tying to, and you learn very quickly that there's just too much of it
Submitted by skrapmetal (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:38:38 EST (#)
Ranking: 1
I guess it's not too difficult to take a minimal interest, but how can one tell if one's neighbor is about to disappear?
For reasons other than speaking publicly against the regime, that is.
Submitted by kaos-king (user info) at 2009-01-09 21:32:24 EST (#)
Ranking: 2
Hmmm, that's pretty hardcore.
I dunno, but I'm pretty sure there's not a whole lot else you could have done... not that it's gonna help.