The Lion, The Witch and The Tide of Low Quality User Created Content (1019 hits)
Category: Computers & InternetRating: 1.59 on 47 reviews (Rate this item) (V)
Submitted by Berty (View user info) at 2007-07-05 05:30:13 EDT
The other day I was listening to the radio as my car shuddered its way to work, as I am often wont to do, and the relics of yesteryear on radio 4 were discussing our blessed child of the 21st century: the internet. Specifically the impact the internet had on literature.
Now it may surprise you to learn that whilst I used to read a lot, my interest in reading has waned considerably in passing years. I like to think that this is a sign of my burgeoning ignorance and mental atrophication that will bring me closer to achieving some paragon of simple virtue. Plus it frees up much more time for scratching myself and farting.
Anyway, the chaps were talking to a chap who was some manner of publisher or writer or magazine columist or something and he was very virulant in expressing his concern at "the fine art of literary expresion being swallowed up by a tide of low quality, user created 'content' that will then be vomited back into the minds of the young." Heady stuff I'll think you'll agree.
I have been witness to the internet for many years, not quite the old HTML days of terribly designed web pages, but I can confidently say that I have been around longer than myspace and was even there to see hotmails conception, albeit through a rather grubby peephole. I can testify that the richness of content, as well as the professionalism and polish with which it is presented, has increased exponentially. My recent addiction to webcomics is a fine example of the talent out there, as is the vast libary of user designed gaming modifications that I'm sure many of you will already be familiar with. Of course, all this is secondary. We must consider todays content against the more established forms of the printed word.
Now, as I mentioned I have not read anything in a while. The last thing I read was an online book; John Dies at the End(http://www.johndiesattheend.com/) and I liked it immensly. I've been a memeber of this community for a very long time and I have learnt a huge amount about different cultures, nations, individuals and philosophies from the "tide of low quality, user created 'content'" than I have from more respectable sources like National Geographic, The Economist and similar.
Obviously the accuracy of all this one man band type stuff is dubious at best. I feel, however, that a combination of the personal level of interaction with the work, as well as the whole "it's probably bollocks" mentality one maintains when sifting through this stuff, enables the reader to be both objective and engaged in a way that the preaching of experts and globetrotters cannot match. I neither like nor fear any stymying of our beloved internet, but I wonder what your thoughts on all this are?
User Reviews
Submitted by Natures_Biggest_Mistake (user info) at 2007-09-06 10:23:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Entertaining Berty. i'm a fan.
Submitted by TheSpook (user info) at 2007-07-05 13:26:17 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
There's shitty writing all over the place, not just the internet.
That's why I can't listen to talk radio. Just a bunch of fools blabbing their useless opinions. I listen to enough assholes all day.
Submitted by Crystle (user info) at 2007-07-05 12:14:40 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
LONG LIVE THE SCROLL!!
DOWN WITH BINDINGS!
Submitted by loki (user info) at 2007-07-05 12:10:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I think e-mail, IM, and text messaging are bigger threats to over all communication then what people are reading online. Not that I expect people to write these grandiose letters like they did in the 1800's but when I get an e-mail that has AOL speak somewhere in it I get concerned that the person writing it isn't thinking and speaking in complete sentences. I get especially concerned when this type of crap starts showing up in work related e-mails. There was this one woman here who used to be really bad about this sort of nonsense. Now I grant you I am not cool but it took me way too much effort to figure out what she was saying. Oddly enough, she's no longer here. I don't know if this had anything to do with it but I really don't know.
Submitted by HighVoltage900 (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:21:00 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
I think that eventually the internet and common written media will find a middle ground. I hate when people say the internet will replace libraries and books. Books cannot be replaced so easily. Books are a staple of human history and will be around longer than any of us will be alive. But that isn't to say that because the internet hasn't had as long of a run doesn't mean it isn't legitimate. Like you said, an eye for bullshit is all you need.
Submitted by icarus1987 (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:10:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I'd tend to agree. And what's the alternative, asking everyone on teh intrawebs to kindly stfu?
Submitted by iddqd (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:09:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
great fuckin post. im interested at the possible responses here, given the vast pontificatation that goes on on this site. i dont disinclude myself with that statement.
id add my own thoughts, if only they werent a sad, desperate parody upon themselves. the sad truth for me is that ive played the sour, jaded, bitter ubersite veteran for so long that noone will take anything i say with any kind of seriousness.
well, at least i get honest reviews, which is more than pretty much anyone else.
i guess you can say that would be my point - to think about the extreme that i personally have had to take to get somethnig resembling genuine criticism
Submitted by kaos-king (user info) at 2007-07-05 10:35:14 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:53:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Does anyone have any concern that online content will usurp and eradicate traditional media? It seems rather unlikely to me, but I am many things that are preceeded by the adjective 'mere'.
_______________________
Nope. And I'm the best example.
My book contains 32 of my best short stories. Granted, they've been edited and polished a bit, but every single one appeared for FREE on both Ubersite and pusleHEAD. And with the exception of the crews from uber and pH, very few other people took the time to go online and read my work in the whole 4 years I've been seriously writing.
However, since I've released my book on May 15th, as of today I've already met a quarter of my full intended sales goal for it. Granted, some of the Uber & pH folks bought it, but I can track my sales, (slowly and far out of date.) Most of my sales are going to individuals who have read very little, if any, of my work.
Hell, I still get people coming up to me and saying "Dude, when did you start writing?" **sigh**
I've pushed my work on Uber and pH for years (the particular site depending on the individual) but I've found that we ALL are quite a minority. Many, many people have no desire to read anything on a screen. They want that book in their hands, they want to be able to carry it about. And if that means spending $19.99 + S&H to get my book instead of reading all the crap for free on here... it seems most are willing to do it.
Submitted by Amontillado (user info) at 2007-07-05 10:27:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Brdn_Nkd (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:26:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No, because as I'm sure you are well aware from your own personal experience that some people like to hold things in their hands.
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Finally, someone who understands both my book collecting (the library isn't very satisfying) and why I dislike buying music online.
Submitted by Beano312003 (user info) at 2007-07-05 10:26:54 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Brdn_Nkd (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:26:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No, because as I'm sure you are well aare from your own personal experience that some people like to hold things in their hands.
It's us old fashioned folk that will champion the continued use of pen and paper.
it's not us that will be the death knell of the printed word. instead, it's the kids who grow up with the internet as thier primary means of communication and media delivery. let me pose this question to you.... when was the last time you sat down and wrote (as in pen/paper) a letter to a friend or relative? I'm not talking about your annual christmas letter or occasion cards, ie b-day, fathers day, boxing day.... i mean a real Dear john, how are you doing? this is what's new in my life blah blah blah, letter. I might have done that a few times as a kid but my parents used to write letters frequently. now? it's so much easier to text your friend or email them or hit thier facebook/myspace page or just call thier damn cell phone that they always have with them. I love my books but I can see the possibility of the bookstore becoming obsolete eventually.
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You have a point my man.
Last time I wrote a letter was to a Doris I was banging. It went "I love you and you are great and I can't wait to get all sweaty with you again etc and so on..."
I was 16.
Submitted by livEvil (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:30:39 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I love lamp
Submitted by inion_de_trua (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:28:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
if that man thought the downfall of literature is teh internet he obviously has not seen the stacks of danielle steele novels at book and grocery stores alike. like everything it depends on where you get your sources. there is some true shit in print out there.
Submitted by Brdn_Nkd (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:26:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No, because as I'm sure you are well aare from your own personal experience that some people like to hold things in their hands.
It's us old fashioned folk that will champion the continued use of pen and paper.
it's not us that will be the death knell of the printed word. instead, it's the kids who grow up with the internet as thier primary means of communication and media delivery. let me pose this question to you.... when was the last time you sat down and wrote (as in pen/paper) a letter to a friend or relative? I'm not talking about your annual christmas letter or occasion cards, ie b-day, fathers day, boxing day.... i mean a real Dear john, how are you doing? this is what's new in my life blah blah blah, letter. I might have done that a few times as a kid but my parents used to write letters frequently. now? it's so much easier to text your friend or email them or hit thier facebook/myspace page or just call thier damn cell phone that they always have with them. I love my books but I can see the possibility of the bookstore becoming obsolete eventually.
Submitted by ICO (user info) at 2007-07-05 08:03:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Speaking for myself and a few of my friends, I can safely say the '1nt4rw3b' has almost completely taken over my television viewing time. I use youtube and the likes to find nice televised shows, so I don't have to sift through the commercials.
A little while ago I bought a great big book filled with all the short stories Arthur Clarke has written. These range from 1 page to something over 50 a piece, making it handy bed-time reading. I also have a book filled with E.A.Poe's work. If you like philosophical SF (not bughunting, superguns, space-races or anything) I can recommend Clarke very highly.
Dutch television just can't deliver on that. Even the Discovery channel is dumbing itself down with custom bike shows where fat, lazy Americans shout at each other.
In short, it's hard to see what the biggest factor is, but there's been a massive shift in Media use for me.
Submitted by electrictoothsyndrome (user info) at 2007-07-05 07:47:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
If you want my true thoughts, I'm just waiting for our governments to dip their grubby fingers in our little pie. Sure, it's already about as foul as it can possibly be, but like it that way...because we made it...and because it is ours.
Freedom, creativity, inspiration, love...they are very much like neighborhood trees, you really never notice them until they are gone, and without good pruning and care, they can often collapse under their own weight.
Submitted by earth_collapse (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:52:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Aye, Aye, Cap'n.
Submitted by EmissionImpossible (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:52:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Too much gayness from Hurty
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:33:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:32:27 BST (#)
Ranking: 2
raisins coz they're left in the sun?
You're odd Hurty
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Damnit. Victory. Destroyed.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:32:38 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
and balding
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:32:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
raisins coz they're left in the sun?
You're odd Hurty
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:31:06 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Apart from those cute little raisins you claim are testicles.
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:30:46 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
By dwarf, do you mean your brother? Or your penis. If the latter, I want no part of it.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:30:31 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
and no, I'm not talking about my willy.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:30:16 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
*turns all of Narnia into a frozen wasteland*
Happy now?
Imma get my dwarf to stab you
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:29:41 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
At least I'm real you fucking ice queen.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:29:04 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Hurty = pot bellied yank
Submitted by Nellypaal (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:16:24 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Until these oft-sited e-books are able to replace the book I can shove in my pocket, read one-handed on the tube and take to the beach without ruin, then I think the humble paperback is here to stay. Besides, they look good on shelves.
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:15:48 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Jake = a queen from a made up realm.
Submitted by DrogoRoch (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:14:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:11:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Who wants some Turkish Delight?
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Is it real stuff? Or that chocky covered stuff?
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:13:28 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Dear America
Listen to this: http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio4/progs/listenagain.shtml
I'm sorry I haven't a clue is a personal favourite.
Submitted by DrogoRoch (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:12:27 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I love books and I dont see the internet usurping them, even if I do wonder how authors earn money these days with hardbacks being sold for a tuppence.
Online stuff is fun to read as you get to see it in its unaltered and rough state.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:12:23 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
shut up cocksmoker
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:11:50 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:10:36 BST (#)
Ranking: 2
Well no Hurty. It's because the radio is more effective at conveying some kinds of information - just as the book provides a more pleasant experience for reading.
The medium is the message.
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O RLY? KTHNXBYE.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:11:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Who wants some Turkish Delight?
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:10:36 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Well no Hurty. It's because the radio is more effective at conveying some kinds of information - just as the book provides a more pleasant experience for reading.
The medium is the message.
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:08:30 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 11:03:58 BST (#)
Ranking: 2
Books will not become obsolete.
Has radio become obsolete because of television?
Why not?
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The blind.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:03:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Books will not become obsolete.
Has radio become obsolete because of television?
Why not?
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 06:00:32 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
No, because as I'm sure you are well aare from your own personal experience that some people like to hold things in their hands.
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*giggles*
Submitted by messmind (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:57:29 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:46:08 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
A pleasant and optimistic take Messmind.
And i forgot : Everybody has the possibility now to become an artist, thereby freeing a lot of creative strength that was stuck in the world before that. The net is a great motivator of synergy, (i love that word), and the results will outweigh the com- and implications by far.
kthxbye!
Submitted by Beano312003 (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:56:34 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:53:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Does anyone have any concern that online content will usurp and eradicate traditional media? It seems rather unlikely to me, but I am many things that are preceeded by the adjective 'mere'.
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No, because as I'm sure you are well aare from your own personal experience that some people like to hold things in their hands.
It's us old fashioned folk that will champion the continued use of pen and paper.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:53:57 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
Does anyone have any concern that online content will usurp and eradicate traditional media? It seems rather unlikely to me, but I am many things that are preceeded by the adjective 'mere'.
Submitted by Beano312003 (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:51:58 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
My thoughts on this....?
You are odd.
There.
How do you like then apples?
I'd rather read a bad book/webpage than watch one minute of TV. Its going to be the death of our nation Berty my man, you mark my words.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:50:13 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I can sit on the toilet with my laptop and read. That's as good as a book.
Submitted by Berty (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:46:08 EDT (#)
Ranking: 0
A pleasant and optimistic take Messmind.
Submitted by redskieslookfake (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:46:03 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
No Comment
Submitted by messmind (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:43:39 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
I haven't read as much before the net was introduced. To me, it brings my reading time up with at least a 100%, online and offline...(not everything is available on the net)
I rather read unedited magnificent work then polished re-edited overpriced stuff, ready to swallow standard novels that are predictable before i've even begun reading them.
The net is an extension, not a replacement.
Submitted by HurtByTheSun (user info) at 2007-07-05 05:36:42 EDT (#)
Ranking: 2
+2 for JDatE. I want a copy!